Opinion: Controversy over Countdown “Vitter” segment…
There’s quite a bit of buzz going on in some corners of the internet over last night’s segment on the Senator Vitter saga on Countdown with substitute host Alison Stewart. I did not see the segment myself but this is what I have been able to piece together. Stewart was interviewing Radar’s Jeff Bercovici on the subject of Vitter and his wife’s choice of outfit selection for the statement Senator Vitter made on Monday.
While the segment played out, a series of lower thirds with rolled by saying things like “Don’t Mess with the Mrs.”, “Vitters’ Sweet Symphony”, “Fashion ho-pas?”, and “Dressed to Kill”. The entire segment concerned Mrs. Vitter’s fashion choice.
STEWART: When you first saw Mrs. Vitter standing by her man, what was your reaction?
BERCOVICI: I think you have to call it disbelief. The idea that somebody would wear that kind of outfit to any sort of crisis control press conference is hard to believe enough in itself. But to go to a conference where your are addressing your husband‘s infidelity with prostitutes and you yourself are looking like—apologies for this—but she‘s looking a little like a prostitute.
STEWART: She looks saucy, we‘ll say.
BERCOVICI: I think it brings up associations that you don‘t want to bring up in that situation.
STEWART: And he is really not in the position right now to say, honey, could you slip into a cardigan and some pearls?
BERCOVICI: Exactly.
This segment has caused a bit of an uproar on the internet for two reasons. One, some objected to the subject. Daily Kos’ Osterizer thought the whole segment was out of bounds…
We rightfully objected to the media scrutiny of Nancy Pelosi’s scarves and sense of fashion. It is a sexist double-standard, and we should be no less in opposition to this double-standard just because the target happens to be a Republican.
The Daily Doubter wasn’t happy either…
…I flipped to Keith Olbermann’s Countdown program on MSNBC to see his guest host and a commentator conducting a segment of the program in which they gossiped with each other about how Senator David Vitter’s wife came to a press conference about his involvement in the DC Madam scandal looking like a prostitute (she was wearing a leapord print dress) and traded jokes about how possibly she dressed like a hussy in order to spite her husband for cheating on her.
Everyone involved in the production of that segment could benefit from reading Amazing Fantasy #15 and letting the moral sink in … with great power there must also come great responsibility.
However Austro Authenian Empire took issue with the whole premise that the outfit was a bad idea…
Huh? What on earth are they talking about? I’ve seen the clip over and over ad nauseam, and to me the dress looks perfectly ordinary, even somewhat conservative. (Here it is, on the right.) What am I missing?
When trying to write about a story concerning something you haven’t seen you sometimes get bombarded with background noise and you have to filter out what’s real and what’s the noise to get at what really happened. Some of the early comments I received seemed to suggest this segment was far more flagrant than it appears to be via the transcript, at least to me. Yeah, the subject is stupid and probably shouldn’t have aired in the first place but it’s not nearly as incendiary as I had expected it to be. Bercovici crossed a line with that “prostitute” crack and, though Stewart didn’t “jump in with both feet” by any means, she definitely got her toes wet. But it wasn’t reprehensible.
The second issue is a lot of people are pointing at the lower third treatment. Or, rather, one particular lower third; “Fashion ho-pas?”. I have been told, but obviously have not seen (the segment isn’t available online at MSNBC.com but I did find a screengrab via Ian Schwartz’s blog), that that lower third popped up while video of Vitter’s wife was playing. Some people have drawn the conclusion from the lower third that the “ho” in “ho-pas” refers to Senator Vitter’s wife…I guess because of the way she dressed.
I can see why some people could come to that conclusion. However I’m not convinced that is the only possible explanation. An alternate explanation is someone just tried to get too cute with spoofing “faux-pas” with “ho-pas” (because of Vitter’s connection to the DC Madam case) that they didn’t stop to think about unintended consequences that someone could associate that with Senator Vitter’s wife. There’s enough ambiguity here as to what the intent was to keep me on the fence.
But a better question, and one I’m surprised nobody on the Countdown staff asked themselves, is why go there in the first place? Why use the word “‘Ho” at all? Especially after what happened with Don Imus? And the fact that Keith Olbermann went on record on Countdown against Imus over his “Hos” remark makes Countdown’s own use of the word, regardless of intent, completely hypocritical.
Steve Capus holds meetings with people in his news division over Imus. It engulfs NBC all the way to the top. And now this happens. On Countdown. With an African American guest host on the screen. Didn’t anybody stop and think, “Whoah…what are we doing here?”
The full segment transcript follows…
STEWART: When Louisiana Senator David Vitter appeared before the media last night, his first public appearance since we learned his phone number showed up on the D.C. Madame‘s records, he brought with him a woman, a woman wearing a form fitting, skin tight, printed dress with a plunging V neckline. In our number two story tonight, it turned out that woman was his wife!
That‘s right, Wendy Vitter, the former prosecutor who told reporters during the Clinton/Lewinsky mess that if her husband ever strayed, she would leave the marriage with his cajones in her hands, showed up to his I have sinned press conference in full va va voom mode.
Despite her slinky dress, the head she turned the most seemed to be her own, as she dropped the hard line she took during the Clinton affair for a kindlier, gentler Vitter in the Vitter affair.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
WENDY VITTER, WIFE OF SENATOR: I forgave David. I made the decision to love him and to recommit to our marriage. To forgive is not always the easy choice, but it was and is the right choice for me.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
STEWART: Allison Janney so plays her in the movie. Let‘s bring in Jeff Bercovici, senior writer at Radar Online, a site described as covering pop, politics, scandal and style. Jeff, you are the right guy to talk to. Thanks for being with us.
JEFF BERCOVICI, RADAR ONLINE: Happy to be here.
STEWART: When you first saw Mrs. Vitter standing by her man, what was your reaction?
BERCOVICI: I think you have to call it disbelief. The idea that somebody would wear that kind of outfit to any sort of crisis control press conference is hard to believe enough in itself. But to go to a conference where your are addressing your husband‘s infidelity with prostitutes and you yourself are looking like—apologies for this—but she‘s looking a little like a prostitute.
STEWART: She looks saucy, we‘ll say.
BERCOVICI: I think it brings up associations that you don‘t want to bring up in that situation.
STEWART: And he is really not in the position right now to say, honey, could you slip into a cardigan and some pearls?
BERCOVICI: Exactly.
STEWART: What do you think Mrs. Vitter accomplished with that particular fashion choice?
BERCOVICI: You can only speculate, but I see two possibilities. One is you do see in a lot of cases where, after a woman‘s husband has strayed, she changes her look afterwards, tries to make herself more attractive to win him back, as it were. The other possibility, though, is maybe this is revenge. Maybe this is her passive aggressive way of getting back at him. I‘m going to make you look like a jerk at the press conference. I‘m going to remind everyone of exactly what you did.
STEWART: It could be personally. She‘s like hey, just because my husband went out looking for hamburger does not mean he does not have steak at home. I‘m a good looking gal.
BERCOVICI: Absolutely. I think any time we hear that a man in public life has cheated on his wife, you always wonder—even if it‘s not fair—you always kind of want to see what she looks right. The same is true if it‘s a woman who cheats.
STEWART: Let me ask you—If someone‘s asking you as a consultant, what is the inappropriate outfit for appearing in public by your husband‘s side to say you‘re find with his notorious life with an escort service?
BERCOVICI: That is a question I get asked a lot, actually. There is one word answer and that is boring. There is a pretty unforgiving dress code in Washington. You see candidates spouses in a lot of pastel pant suits and Navy dresses. There is a reason for it. In politics, in general, if people are talking about what you‘re wearing, it‘s a bad thing.
STEWART: Finally, is it possible we have witnessed some kind of sea change here where respectable wives are going to go there? They‘re going to go to this next level, considering what their husbands may be doing in their off hours?
BERCOVICI: You may be on to something. We could actually be seeing a complete reversal of the laws of skankery. I know that you must have seen when Paris Hilton got out of prison that she was wearing a very prim Channel type jacket and maybe that is just—everyone is going to trade places from now on. Maybe we will see Hillary Clinton on the campaign trail in a platinum wig and fish nets.
STEWART: The world is topsy turvy. Cat and dog living together if that happens. Jeff Bercovici with Radar Online, thanks for stopping by.
BERCOVICI: Thanks for having me.
This happened on MSNBC…why is anyone surprised? Low-class, poorly produced, bad programming is a staple of MSNBC’s daytime and primetime lineup.
Comment by Anonymous — July 18, 2007 @ 4:41 pm
Fantastic PR move by Countdown. When the host is away the producer will have a “HO clothes” segment sure to get “buzz” and viewers to tune in when the host returns. Brace yourself for the “special comment” by returning host that will surely pontificate on how the REAL issue is Vitters actions, not what his wife wears. You all were warned….
Comment by Obama in 08! — July 18, 2007 @ 4:42 pm
#2:
Nah, Keith will sve his next “Speshul Kommint” for defending Daily Kos after the dustup between his most loyal faction and BOR.
Comment by eddiebear — July 18, 2007 @ 4:57 pm
Oh come on people, what does any good wife wear after finding out that your hubby prefers the company of hookers? She’s trying to spice it up a little. Cut her some slack will ya?
Comment by Mary Snow — July 18, 2007 @ 5:08 pm
Brilliant PR move. They’re not going to fire Keith. Notice the period. His show pokes fun at everybody and anything. Mostly Republicans of course. Agree with #2 completely. One million by fall.
Comment by Peoplepeople — July 18, 2007 @ 5:17 pm
I have no pity for the woman. Another right wing hypocrite who was full of righteous indignation over Hillary Clinton standing by her man and look what she does.
Comment by elmonica — July 18, 2007 @ 5:36 pm
Leave it to elmo to call people hypocrites, when she exhibits the exact behavior she criticizes. If FOX were calling a
Dems wife a “ho”, she’s be on here throwing a temper tantrum.
Elmo & PP, it’s pathetic and sad no matter what station did it, or who they directed it toward.
Comment by bigred — July 18, 2007 @ 5:57 pm
elmonica… are you that so far up your own butt that you can’t even read the story? The post is about KO’s show using a slur that got another MSNBC employee fired.
Instead, you go back onto your same-old same-old blah blah about how much you hate Republicans. The only thing you forgot to blame it on (somehow) was FOX!
Oh… and BTW… unless you know about Vitter saying something BEFORE he got into congress, you should probably know that he was only elected to the House in 1999. Any evidence, or just more talking from the backside?
Comment by ImNotBlue — July 18, 2007 @ 6:01 pm
ImNotBlue, all the outrage over what Imus said was due to using NAPPY in front of HO. See, any man or woman can be a HO (or not) but not all of them can possess NAPPY hair. Which makes it a racial slur.
Comment by Terance — July 18, 2007 @ 6:15 pm
No Terance. If that is the case then why did Sharpton get mad at TMZ for using Robo-Ho???
Comment by Noelle — July 18, 2007 @ 6:24 pm
Terance, thanks for clarifying the terms by which MSNBC/NBC anchors may denigrate and objectify women. Would that be listed in their stylebook or editorial guidelines? You know, I just don’t hear MSNBC air staff refer to men as “hos” very often. As a matter of fact, I’ve never heard it done at all. Maybe I wasn’t watching during that hour.
Comment by Goldfish — July 18, 2007 @ 6:32 pm
Goldfish, first off, I never said anything about MSNBC’s use of the term. And I don’t condone the term “HO” on any news channel or in everyday life. Whether you want to admit it or not, calling an African American a “nappy headed ho” is different than using the same term to a white person. Its a hurtful slur based on ethnicity.
Comment by Terance — July 18, 2007 @ 6:39 pm
I don’t think this was a PR stunt. KO and his show have a history of making nasty sexist and misogynistic remarks.
Mrs. Vitter is a “ho”, Paris Hilton is a “slut”, Lindsay Lohan’s mom is a “bag”, Rita Cosby is “dumber than a suitcase of rocks”, Britney Spears is a “tart”, Melana Trump is a “child bride”, Ann Coulter is a “horse”, etc.
Sure, I hate KO. But even his fanatics see it. There have been articles at the Huffington Post, Daily Kos, Democratic Undergound, TomPaine, etc… that criticize KO & Countdown for repeated misogynist comments.
I guess if this is part of some bizarre PR stunt to get word out that KO is a vile sexist pig, then congrats. It’s working.
Comment by TBDave — July 18, 2007 @ 6:50 pm
Oh Thank You so much Terance for clairifying for us the proper use of the word “Ho”. It’s okay when it’s used against a GOP woman but wrong if you attached it to a “ethnicity” slur.
and I’m hardly surprised at the reaction here to what was said on Countdown from his fans. They reacted in a similar fashion when the Paris Hilton “slut and battery” episode occured. Their reasoning was that Paris Hilton wasn’t a paragon of virtue and that it was perfectly okay for Olbermann to espouse the view that “worse things have happened to her face” (a reference to a sex act that degrades women), complete with the caption “Slut and Battery”. You see, in their minds, only CERTAIN women deserve to be treated with their respect, and oops, sorry, celebrity women and those from teh GOP don’t fall into that category.
So we can point out to them why it’s wrong for ANY woman to be degraded with such terms and they still aren’t going to get it just so long as it’s a Republican, or in Ms. Hilton’s case, a celeb “slut”.
I guess Elmonica would have been happier had Mrs. Vitter left her husband, destroyed their marriage and broken up their home. The thing is you never know what you’re going to do unless you find yourself in a situation. and Mrs. Vitter did find herself in that exact same situation as Hillary Rodham Clinton did. There is such a thing as irony you know and I bet that Mrs. Vitter has gained a great deal of insight into Mrs. Clinton’s situation at that time since her initial statement. Was Mrs. Vitter wrong to say what she said about Hillary and Bill? Yes, she was. It wasn’t her marriage and she had no right to comment on it, just as Elmonica and crew have no right to comment on the Vitters marriage or anyone else’s. But they tell themselves that it’s okay because hey, they’re Republicans so big deal right? The idea is supposed to be to insult them no matter what which is why they lap up and then justify anything that Olbermann and crew say that demeans ANY woman.
And so far as her clothing goes-I still don’t see what’s wrong with what she had on. I guess they are still clinging to some outdated 50’s idea where women should stay covered up and keep their mouths shut–that is, if they are Republican women, huh?
Comment by Alison — July 18, 2007 @ 7:01 pm
Typical from the juveniles that produce KO’s show. Its a good thing he wasn’t there. BTW, I am not sure if MSNBC can fire Stewart. She only fills in now and works for NPR.
Comment by JMK24 — July 18, 2007 @ 7:27 pm
I truly believe msnbc is the worst network on cable and satellite.
Comment by A.W — July 18, 2007 @ 7:33 pm
The bottom line is the comment was uncalled for and offensive and again proves what big fat hypocrites they are on MSNBC. Imus got fired for a similar comment - his in a poor attempt at humor when MSNBC meant to be insulting and mean spirited - we know they did. They’re disgraceful but who cares, so few people bother to watch anyway.
Comment by J G — July 18, 2007 @ 7:34 pm
Hang on. Stewart didn’t put that graphic up and didn’t use the term. She’s not responsible.
Comment by Spud — July 18, 2007 @ 7:40 pm
Impeached President Clinton lied to the American people, and a grand jury. This person got up, confessed and is no where near the point where the Impeached president tried to redefine sex. Hilary could care less what her “husband” does. As long as she holds office and power, he can sleep at the zoo with a box of cigars.
Comment by Hening — July 18, 2007 @ 7:42 pm
#18, Thank you Spud. Who watched this last night from above? Everyone is blowing this way out of context because, guess what?…it’s MSNBC. So predictable. Keep the free publicity going though. Tell your friends, family, hell, tell strangers on the streets for all I care, how ‘outraged’ you are with the comment. They’ll check KO out. You people, who I might add, who don’t even watch the damn cable station to begin with.
Comment by Peoplepeople — July 18, 2007 @ 7:48 pm
I guess Elmonica would have been happier had Mrs. Vitter left her husband, destroyed their marriage and broken up their home.
Alison: No. Elmonica would only be happy if she shot her husband to death, similar to that guy in Wyoming who shot his wife while she was singing.
Comment by Ira — July 18, 2007 @ 8:02 pm
Terance, I don’t need your lectures on misogynistic or ethnic slurs, thanks. I don’t think the term “ho” is more acceptable when insulting women in general than if used as a part of a racial slur. Both are equally offensive and disturbing. Wake up, Terance.
Unfortunately, TBDave is right. KO has a history with this kind of thing. Whoever stood in as managing editor and approved the graphic is responsible, not who actually put it up.
Comment by Goldfish — July 18, 2007 @ 8:04 pm
Leave the woman alone and let her dress how she wants to. Goodness knows she has been through so much and deserves to wear whatever she chooses!
Comment by Ava N. — July 18, 2007 @ 8:23 pm
Another example of MSNBC’s double standards and hypocrisy. Still missing Imus in the Morning.
Comment by julie — July 18, 2007 @ 9:15 pm
#
I don’t think this was a PR stunt. KO and his show have a history of making nasty sexist and misogynistic remarks.
Mrs. Vitter is a “ho”, Paris Hilton is a “slut”, Lindsay Lohan’s mom is a “bag”, Rita Cosby is “dumber than a suitcase of rocks”, Britney Spears is a “tart”, Melana Trump is a “child bride”, Ann Coulter is a “horse”, etc.
Sure, I hate KO. But even his fanatics see it. There have been articles at the Huffington Post, Daily Kos, Democratic Undergound, TomPaine, etc… that criticize KO & Countdown for repeated misogynist comments.
I guess if this is part of some bizarre PR stunt to get word out that KO is a vile sexist pig, then congrats. It’s working.
Oh please like you give a crap. The absolute only reason you’re complaining is because he’s of a different political ideology than you so stop acting like you actually care that he said any of those things.
Comment by Steve — July 18, 2007 @ 9:26 pm
It’s really amazing how the crazies criticize Olbermann can for something he did not do and was nowhere near when it happened. Conservatives talk about Bush Derangement Syndrome, well I think the repeated posts on this message board show an unhealthy case of Olbermann Derangement Syndrome.
Comment by Steve — July 18, 2007 @ 9:34 pm
Steve, the problem goes way, way beyond an ideology issue. This is morning show radio crap… the kind of stuff that got Imus fired. Olbermann’s show is presented as a “news” program. On my cable guide, Countdown is a described as “a nightly news program counting down the top 5 stories of the day”.
Referring to anyone as a “ho” has no place on a news program.
Olbermann’s comments that Alison referenced, and the banner his producers put up last night, are despicable. I would say the same thing if Sean Hannity said them.
Comment by bigred — July 18, 2007 @ 9:44 pm
Spud, with all due respect, it says “Fashion Ho-Pas”–I believe that to be a direct reference to what Mrs. Vitter had on and I don’t see how any other conclusion could possibly be gathered from that caption.
Comment by Alison — July 18, 2007 @ 9:58 pm
Terance are you saying that when refering to a group of young women college athletes, had Imus only used “HO” and nothing else that he would still have his job today?
Comment by Aunt Mary — July 19, 2007 @ 1:33 am
Let’s not forget that Imus wasn’t the only one fired. Bernard was canned too and he said “hardcore hos,” nothing about nappy there. So unless you are going to say that “hardcore” is a hateful, racial slur, all this crap about two different levels of insult can go right out the window. Anyone could have called Mrs. Vitter a hardcore ho and been fine. Bernie could have said it, Imus could have said it. Hell they could have called Condoleeza Rice a hardcore ho OR a nappy headed ho and you wouldn’t have heard a peep from the bigoted, hate-mongering racist Al Sharpton. Double standard. Period.
Comment by Spades — July 19, 2007 @ 6:29 am
Aunt Mary, yes, if Imus had only used “HO” he would still be employed. With that said, he might of been fined, suspended, or both. But, the aforementioned “nappy” was the deal breaker.
Comment by Terance — July 19, 2007 @ 7:25 am
The killer is that I don’t think that the dress is that revealing or inappropriate. Did they make up the captions before they saw what she was wearing? So, it’s leopard print. It seems to be a reasonable length, is not all that low cut and has short sleeves. It’s not a dress that you’re going to see in the Combat Zone!
Comment by Bill — July 19, 2007 @ 7:42 am
MSNBC knew what Berkovici was going to be talking about. They obviously had to know ahead of time to prepare the graphic. I don’t Allison is to blame for the graphic, but I think someone should have spoken up before the show and realized the hypocracy of the situation,considering that they fired Imus and Bernie for basically the same thing. Where was all the outrage of the staff from NBC and MSNBC?
Also, the comments from a few of their guests, are just crude. Especially Michael Musto.
Comment by shannon20 — July 19, 2007 @ 9:55 am
But let us not forget that just last week, big Al Sharpton was all over the news because of the “Robo-ho” incident, saying that “Ho” has no place in news.
I expect to see Al any minute now… Still waiting… Not losing hope yet… Aaaaand, we’re done.
Comment by ImNotBlue — July 19, 2007 @ 12:00 pm
Imus is going to have so much fun with MSNBC when he returns - it’s going to be great. They are such hypocrites. This woman looks perfectly fine but MSNBC wanted to be nasty because she’s a conservative.
Comment by Mel — July 19, 2007 @ 12:12 pm
# 5 Peoplespeople:
“Brilliant PR move. They’re not going to fire Keith.
Notice the period. His show pokes fun at everybody
and anything”.
Peoplespeople, you are as big a hypocrite as MSNBC! The same could be said about Imus - HIS SHOW POKES FUN AT EVERYBODY AND ANYTHING!!!
I’d love to hear you explain the difference…Oh - I’ll bet you were one of the idiots that bad-mouthed Imus, BUT HAD NEVER WATCHED THE SHOW.
Or…….you really ARE Dan Abrams…..seems like I’ve accused you of that before.
Comment by Linda S — July 21, 2007 @ 7:53 pm
I watched Countdown today, Keith was on and he appaulogized over the incident about the Vitter segment that took place last week. He did this 25 minutes into the program.
Comment by Clarence — July 23, 2007 @ 8:43 pm
Too funny. The man in the picture HIRED WHORES, and you think the caption can only be about about her. I see no apology to Hillary for treating her like dirt, but the outrage is thick thick thick for the John and his wife.
Comment by Don Ho — July 24, 2007 @ 9:11 am
when one dresses like a ho, when should expect to be talked about like a ho.
An apology should of not been neccessary.
Comment by ken — July 24, 2007 @ 9:35 am
Ha! Ha! Ha! The was funny. Implying that that Right-Wing Wacko was dressed like a ho is hillarious! neo-Cons - Get Over It!
Comment by ohgee — July 24, 2007 @ 12:22 pm
Not to defend K.O and i am a big Iman fam but Bernard also said something like “they are like the Grizzlies” too so he went further than calling them “rough” “hos” etc. I defended Imus on my blog for what he referenced which was the Spike Lee movie and the context vis a vis Morning Radio and edgy humor which many Black comedians have used too so imho nobody should be fired, maybe a couple weeks off for violating MSNBC standards. Free Speech should be protected above all.
Comment by john smith — July 24, 2007 @ 1:10 pm
What was the problem. These people pick the profession that their in and if they choose to belittle the honorable position that the voters allowed them to have by becoming a whore monger what would be wrong with ragging on his stupid wife. Let’s face it, she looked more like streetmeat then he did. I look at it this way, I don’t like either of them because it will be their fault when their kids have to grow up hearing that name they’ve been calling their dad.
Comment by dras — July 24, 2007 @ 5:18 pm
fire ko
Comment by chris mathews — July 24, 2007 @ 8:24 pm