Premature prognostications?
Last week TVNewser had an item on Countdown comning very close to an O’Reilly-less Factor in the Demo for the first few days of the week and wrote it up as a part of a trend for Countdown. Well if Tuesday is any indication, that “trend” didn’t last long as The Factor beat Countdown handily in the Demo…
8PM - P2+ (25-54)
O’Reilly Factor- 2,358,000 viewers (425,000)
Out in the Open – 599,000 viewers (155,000)
Countdown w/ Olbermann – 686,000 viewers (256,000)
Fast Money – a scratch with 98,000 viewers (a scratch with 13,000)
Nancy Grace – 516,000 viewers (113,000)
(numbers are Live)
TVnewswer also had this item in which MS-NBC mentioned April 18th as another ratings win over Bill O’Reilly:
“Countdown with Keith Olbermann beat The O’Reilly Factor in the 25-54 demo last Thursday. MSNBC tells us that has only happened once before: April 18, 2007. Bill O’Reilly was on vacation last week.”
I checked the ratings archive here, to sadly be reminded that is when the VA-Tech shootings happened. NBC/MS-NBC had some exclusive rights to the killer’s video manifesto as well. Does anyone else find it just a little bit creepy that MS-NBC would tout a ratings win within such a tragedy?
Comment by Obama in 08! — September 6, 2007 @ 3:57 pm
Mediabistro number is much closer than the number you posted.
http://www.mediabistro.com/tvnewser/ratings/the_scoreboard_tuesday_sept_4_66469.asp#email
Comment by chi — September 6, 2007 @ 4:02 pm
“Does anyone else find it just a little bit creepy that MS-NBC would tout a ratings win within such a tragedy?”
This is normal for MSNBC as well as TVN, especially when Brian was running the show.
Comment by Jim — September 6, 2007 @ 4:03 pm
Check out News Corpse (http://www.newscorpse.com/ncWP/?p=589) and Tvnewser (http://www.mediabistro.com/tvnewser/ratings/the_scoreboard_tuesday_sept_4_66469.asp#more) numbers.
Why are Spud numbers so off…
Comment by NewsJunkie — September 6, 2007 @ 4:20 pm
Because there’s more than one set of numbers out there. TVNewser uses Live+SD. I use just Live. No big conspiracy here…
Comment by Spud — September 6, 2007 @ 4:21 pm
Like the new editor there is any better? I thought Brian was a bit too rah-rah all things NBC but this new guy takes it to levels Brian would have blushed at. Yesterday at one point, 75% of what he had posted were NBC-CNBC-MSNBC related. The fact that MSNBC would crow over this “victory” when O’Reilly wasn’t even there is typical, but the sheer sloppiness of TVN not checking as to why the ratings were so good for Olbermann that ONE night back in April–sheer laziness! Come on Dude, they are right there archived on the site for anybody to go look up and fact-check!
Chi–the reason TVN’s numbers differ from ICN’s is that ICN uses “Live” numbers which means the actual people who watched a show. TVN prefers to use the inflated “Live Plus” ratings, which measures the number of people who watched the show Live AND those who recorded the program on DVR/TIVO. MSNBC and particularly Countdown seem to benefit greatly from those inflated Live Plus ratings but there’s no proof that people who record a show ever actually watch it. I’ve got shows sitting on my DVR from last YEAR that I haven’t watched. Anyway, that’s the difference between the TVN vs. ICN numbers. If you want to know what people REALLY watched, stick with ICN!
Comment by Alison — September 6, 2007 @ 4:27 pm
So then Spud, maybe you shouldnt compare what tvnewser is saying, because according to their numbers, he did beat them and on tuesday though O’Reilly did beat Olbermann again, KO had 367,000 in the demo, 100,000 different than you did. That number for KO is an extroadinary amount.
Comment by randy — September 6, 2007 @ 4:35 pm
“but the sheer sloppiness of TVN not checking as to why the ratings were so good for Olbermann that ONE night back in April–sheer laziness! ”
Or TVN actually knew why the numbers were good, but are just trying to pull one over on us.
Comment by Jim — September 6, 2007 @ 4:47 pm
So then Spud, maybe you shouldnt compare what tvnewser is saying, because according to their numbers, he did beat them and on tuesday though O’Reilly did beat Olbermann again, KO had 367,000 in the demo, 100,000 different than you did.
That is true. But it is also true that Countdown wasn’t anywhere near as close as the previous week’s numbers were. And it was those numbers which prompted the original trend post. So while you’re right to a point that an apples to oranges comparison is not the best method, my point is still valid when you do an apples to apples comparison.
Comment by Spud — September 6, 2007 @ 5:05 pm
Anyway, that’s the difference between the TVN vs. ICN numbers. If you want to know what people REALLY watched, stick with ICN!
That’s not entirely accurate or fair. Some networks use Live+SD because their numbers look better. If all the networks looked better using Live+SD they’d all be using it. However the reality is some networks get a bigger boost than others when using it. And let’s face it, if a network can make itself look good without looking ridiculous in doing so, they’ll probably try it.
We’re living in an age of turbulence in the ratings. With new technologies come new ways to measure ratings. This means there will continue to be more than one set of numbers out there. There is no consensus out there on which set is the right set or the best set or the most accurate set. This causes a lot of headaches for people like me who post numbers. So you need to keep all this in mind when looking at the ratings.
Comment by Spud — September 6, 2007 @ 5:12 pm
It’s called spinning the numbers..thats what KO supporters do…O’Reilly is still way ahead of KO like Fox is way ahead of MSNBC and that isn’t going to change because KO has only one act…it’s the same show every night..bash Bush..bash O’Reilly..bash FOX and every other week have a “Special Comment” where he get’s all “serious” and calls for the impeachment or resignation of Bush…thats Countdown in a nutshell..and frankly I don’t know what’ll he’ll do after Bush is gone..if his candidate Hillary is elected nobodys going want to watch night after night as he plays kissa**.
KO is not the second coming of Edward R. Murrow he is only a second rate Sportscaster who is puffed up by a bunch of Nutroots because he hates Bush.
Comment by mlong — September 6, 2007 @ 6:54 pm
You can spin it any way you like, but Bo kicks Bathtub Boy’s ass night after night.
Comment by Tom P — September 6, 2007 @ 6:54 pm
Just one of many things Olberman apparently does prematurely.
Comment by Amused — September 7, 2007 @ 6:50 am